Amna Nawaz:
Late-night show host Stephen Colbert is going after his soon-to-be-former network, saying CBS blocked him from airing an interview on the broadcast. That interview was with James Talarico, a Texas Democrat running for Senate who’s also been a vocal critic of President Trump and his policies.
Colbert said he was told the interview could violate the so-called equal time rule, which mandates that all political candidates receive equal on-air opportunities. Entertainment shows, including late-night and daytime talk shows, have long been the exception to that rule.
But, back in January, FCC Chairman Brendan Carr released a letter saying that could change.
Here’s Colbert from last night.
Stephen Colbert, Host, “The Late Show With Stephen Colbert”: In this letter, Carr said he was thinking about dropping the exception for talk shows because he said some of them were motivated by partisan purposes.
Well, sir, you’re chairman of the FCC, so FCCU, because I think…
(Cheering)
Stephen Colbert:
Because I think you are motivated by partisan purposes yourself.
(Cheering)
Stephen Colbert:
Sir, you smelt it because you dealt it.
(Laughter)
Amna Nawaz:
For more, I’m joined now by FCC Commissioner Anna Gomez.
Welcome back to the “News Hour.” Thanks for being here.
Anna Gomez, Commissioner, Federal Communications Commission:
Thank you. It’s good to be here.
Amna Nawaz:
I should also note we did invite FCC Chairman Brendan Carr to the show, but his office did not respond. He’s welcome to join us in the future.
I want to put to you some confusing narratives we have here. Colbert, we have heard, is saying he was told by CBS lawyers Talarico could not be on the broadcast. So he ran the interview on YouTube instead. But CBS in a statement today said that Colbert was not prohibited from airing the interview.
He was told it could trigger the FCC equal time rule and that he chose to stream it on YouTube instead. What do you make of these two narratives?
Anna Gomez:
Well, I don’t know between the two facts that are being provided, but I do know that what the FCC did this year was, it put out a notice about the equal time rule that doesn’t really give us anything new.
The equal time rule has been on the books for a very long time. It’s a part of the statute. And what it does is, it allows legally qualified candidates to request equal time if a show puts on another legally qualified candidate.
Amna Nawaz:
OK.
Anna Gomez:
But there’s something called the bona fide news exemption. And that is something that basically says, if you are providing programming that is newsworthy, then you are exempt from this equal time requirement.
The FCC has longstanding practice of declaring news — entertainment programs to be newsworthy, for example, “The Tonight Show,” Sally Jessy Raphael, “Politically Incorrect,” “Donahue.” Those were all found to be bona fide news exemptions because of the newsworthiness of their programs.
Amna Nawaz:
So is that a rule that the FCC chairman could change? Could that equal time rule now be expanded to include daytime and late-night shows that were previously exempt?
Anna Gomez:
Well, what the FCC did was it put out a public notice that said, hey, just because we have this precedent doesn’t mean that everything that you are doing is actually subject to this news exemption. And we want to now review everything that you’re doing in order to make that determination.
One of the things that’s really important to note is that in declaring whether something is subject to the bona fide news exemption, what it does is, it says — has the producer, the independent producer or the broadcaster, made a decision that is reasonable about the newsworthiness of that particular programming, as opposed to having the candidate, the programming, the format, the content being done for purposes of harming or helping a particular candidate?
The FCC relies on the reasonable good faith judgment of the broadcasters in making that determination. So the point that I’m trying to make here is that this public notice that the commission put out is not anything new. It is saying we have this equal time rule and we want people to be aware of that.
Amna Nawaz:
Yes. And yet at the same time it’s now triggered this episode that we’re all talking about.
I mean, you did accuse CBS of corporate capitulation to administration efforts to censor and control speech. And Texas State Rep. James Talarico in that interview that aired on YouTube said sort of the same thing. And take a listen to how he put it.
State Rep. James Talarico (D-TX):
Corporate media executives are selling out the First Amendment to curry favor with corrupt politicians. And a threat to any of our First Amendment rights is a threat to all of our First Amendment rights.
(Cheering)
Amna Nawaz:
There are those who are going to say the interview was published, right? We are airing it. Others are airing it. People are talking about it. Why censorship concerns?
Anna Gomez:
The concern here is because this is a part of a broader pattern by this FCC and this administration to get our corporate parents of our broadcasters to capitulate and to modify how they are reporting the news, to do so in a way that this administration likes.
Anything they don’t like, they want to control and they want to censor. So, in this case, it’s just part of a broader pattern. Now, maybe it’s true that the facts between CBS and the Colbert show are different, but the fact that we’re in this moment and talking about this tells you that we are in a very precarious moment for our First Amendment.
And the FCC needs to stay out of content regulation because our First Amendment prohibits it.
Amna Nawaz:
So what is the impact of that pattern as you lay it out? How could it change programming, especially when we’re talking about a year in which there are midterm elections coming up?
Anna Gomez:
Broadcasters are already self-censoring because they don’t want to get before the crosshairs of this administration. And that is bad for the First Amendment. It’s bad for the freedom of the press. We need broadcasters, we need all journalists to hold us to account, because that is their role in our democracy.
So this is very serious.
Amna Nawaz:
That is FCC Commissioner Anna Gomez joining us tonight.
Commissioner Gomez, thank you for your time. Really appreciate it.
Anna Gomez:
Thank you.
