Amna Nawaz:
Authorities are still searching for answers and for the alleged gunman in the shooting at Brown University four days ago. Two students were killed and nine others injured.
Officials have released photos and video showing a person of interest walking near the campus hours before the shooting. The FBI is offering a $50,000 reward for information leading to an arrest. There’s still concern in Providence about the whereabouts of the shooter.
Providence Mayor Brett Smiley tried to provide reassurance to residents this evening.
Brett Smiley (D), Mayor of Providence, Rhode Island: The best information we have is that there is no credible, actionable, specific threat that has occurred since Saturday. And in order to enhance and ensure the safety of our community, we have stepped up law enforcement efforts throughout the city in a precautionary measure.
Amna Nawaz:
For more, I’m joined now by Juliette Kayyem. She’s a professor at the Harvard Kennedy School of Government and former assistant secretary at the Department of Homeland Security in the Obama administration.
Juliette, thank you for joining us.
Juliette Kayyem, Former U.S. Department of Homeland Security Assistant Secretary: Thanks for having me.
Amna Nawaz:
So you heard officials there asking for the public’s help, releasing these images.
From your experience, how helpful could this be, these images in particular? And what do you make of the fact that they still have not identified or found this suspect?
Juliette Kayyem:
Yes.
I mean, in some ways, this isn’t really a manhunt because they don’t know who the man is. A manhunt is generally you have an image or even a name and you’re going after them, talking to family and friends. It is remarkable and unusual in this day and age, with that many cameras, with students with phones, that they cannot get, seem to get a great picture of his face.
He was, of course, masked through — in some of these pictures or in all the pictures. So this will be helpful for the sole purpose of convincing someone who recognizes him, who already knows him to come forward. He has a unique gait. He has a unique physique, a stocky walk.
If you knew him, you might be able to identify him. So that, with the — the pictures, with the ransom, is simply trying to lure family and/or friends to come forward. But if you just pass this guy on the street, you would not know who it was.
Amna Nawaz:
In these kinds of cases though, the longer it goes on, does it make it less likely that they will find this person?
Juliette Kayyem:
Well, there’s two pieces to that. One is, look, they had a course-correction about a day-and-a-half ago, right, with this person of interest not being the person. And so they lost some time. And losing time means that he has — he can get away and get away further.
It also means that evidence that he might have left — he was sort of around the area for a couple hours before — could be destroyed. There was a lot of snow. I was in Providence. There was a lot of snow that came down after the killings.
But this time, they are using now to collect videos from people who probably didn’t know they had them. There’s lots of Ring camera videos and other videos that may at some stage give them a better identification.
Amna Nawaz:
I’m sure you have seen too there have been some reports about tensions between officials in Providence and the FBI,who are also, of course, on the ground investigating, some questions about responsibility.
I want to play for you a piece of sound from President Trump yesterday who spoke to this when he was asked about why he was taking the FBI so long to identify the shooter. Take a listen.
President Donald Trump:
But you really have to ask the school a little bit more about that, because this was a school problem. They had their own guards, they had their own police, they had their own everything. But you would have to ask that question really to the school, not to the FBI. We came in after the fact. And the FBI will do a good job, but they came in after the fact.
Amna Nawaz:
Juliette, what do you make of what the president had to say there?
Juliette Kayyem:
The school has no arrest or investigatory authority. I think there are great questions about the university, to the university about, essentially, its accessibility. What has it learned from this? How is it going to protect students when they come back?
But the investigation is clearly led by local, state, and federal law enforcement agencies, including the FBI. I’m not disclosing anything. The Rhode Island attorney general said it, that the FBI basically got way ahead of the investigation. FBI Director Kash Patel has just a very destructive habit of putting things on Twitter before they can be verified.
And so what happened is, when they had that person of interest, all focus went there, because the FBI essentially announced it, and then they had to unwind it. The challenge, of course, as I said, is not only did they lose time. You’re really beginning to have a community lose confidence. And that you cannot have.
It looks like they’re too divided. They did a regroup press conference about an hour ago. FBI was back at the table. Everyone was talking about unity of effort, and one can hope that they find this guy, or identify him at least, so that the hunt can begin.
Amna Nawaz:
Meanwhile, Juliette, I want to tap into your expertise to ask you about the other mass shooting that we are following. That was the one targeting Hanukkah celebrations at Bondi Beach in Australia.
We reported authorities are now calling it a terrorist attack. The Australian prime minister said it appears to be inspired by ISIS. We reported they found homemade Islamic State flags in the shooter’s car. From your expertise, is there a resurgent ISIS threat to be worried about here?
Juliette Kayyem:
Yes. I mean, I think there’s no question about it. It’s been one that we have been watching through 2025. It’s not as organized. There’s not the same kind of leadership.
But, basically, about four months ago, ISIS said or put statements out about targeting Jewish organizations or Jewish meetings, anything that would be public. We saw this now in Australia. But we can’t forget also two service members were killed in Syria on Friday by someone who — by ISIS.
And so we do worry in the counterterrorism field about this resurgence, as ISIS looking at a world destabilized, and much of the world, Europe, Russia, China and the U.S., are focused on other things. So it’s a tragedy and might — and is a sign of what ISIS wants to happen in 2026.
Amna Nawaz:
Juliette Kayyem of Harvard Kennedy School of Government, always good to speak with you. Thank you.
Juliette Kayyem:
Thank you.
